04/05 - Christopher Walken/Panic at the Disco, Official Review Thread Options

[Carlapalooza]

Technically, SNL airs during 'Safe Harbor' hours (10 PM - 6 AM) with much less stringent guidelines as to what can and cannot be said on air. I've yet to see a major broadcast network truly make use of the guideline though. Even Comedy Central (which is not under the FCC's domain, being a cable company) waits until 1 AM to air its 'Secret Stash' uncensored programming.
The other aspect of this is advertisers... networks are about making money and if a major advertiser decides the program its purchasing advertising on is objectionable, then it may pull its support. The GD (I'm selfcensoring because I prefer the euphemism to any censorship this board might automate onto me) is fairly offensive amongst the religious conservatives in the country, and the advertiser is worried that they won't be able to reach those audiences. Obviously, the completely ignored flipside to this is that if you have a popular show, regardless of the content, advertisers will come.
Censorship is not controlled via the FCC directly, NBC has its own censors that determine internally what it will or will not air, and tends to be more stringent as they'd rather avoid the costs and 'negative' publicity of a legal battle.
Previously, music acts have been known to selfcensor (as Panic! at the Disco did, or Korn's appearance) or play the song normal and be blanked by the NBC soundboard (Green Day's "American Idiot"). But the last time a band performed with the soundboard adding the blanks (System of a Down's "B.Y.O.B."), Daron Malakian took the opportunity to shout an extended, unplanned F-bomb for absolutely no reason whatsoever - maybe they have changed their policy in what the guests are allowed to do? Just postulating. Either way, Malakian acted like a baby.

just wanted to state that the existence of previous instances where the phrase was cleaned up for later broadcast indicates that it is on NBC's 'forbidden' list, regardless of the phrase's legal status.

Does NBC truly have "GD" on their naughty list, even though it's not on the FCC's? Bizarre! If they couldn't care less about the negative publicity and complaints lately about their political sketches but they think allowing the words "Closing the GD door" would be the thing to send some viewers over the edge, that attitude makes no sense to me. And Comedy Central waits until 1 to show the goods? Seriously? Wow - I would have thought they'd be the most flexible there.

For me, words coming out of someone else's mouth are their own thoughts, ideas, and feelings. And, their words can only offend someone if that person allows themself to feel offended. How does hearing Panic at the Disco sing, "Closing the GD door", affect anyone's life, personally? The person that said it is just expressing that they feel very strongly about the closing of that f'ing door. haha If they want to do that using the words GD, as nothing more than an intensifier against an inanimate object, I don't see how that could possibly hurt anyone. Besides, it's hard to substitute a different word for the one that truly reflects how you feel. If I stub my toe, badly, on the corner of something, I'd definitely be selecting the ol' F-word. haha If I had to change it to, let's say, "Dang it" or "Shoot", it just wouldn't cut it. It would stifle my expression of pain and I would feel incomplete. Ahaha!

p.s. Is Tom Davis still writing for SNL?

[jrob321]

I've been watching SNL religiously since 1975. It's had its ups and downs, but I've got to say this was one of the more enjoyable episodes. Since the writer's strike the show is picking itself back up from what seemed to be a period of the doldrums.

Christopher Walken has become a parody of himself and he plays it perfectly. To read all these posts about how bad he was makes me wonder if people are tuning in on a Saturday night to laugh, or if they're looking for a flawless Broadway performance. His stilted way of speaking and attention to the cue cards is hilarious because it's deliberate and intentional!

I don't think I'm lowering the bar here. What SNL does week to week is a tremendous undertaking. Sometimes it works and sometimes it flops. This week worked really well for me and it looked like Walken and the cast had a great time.

Cheers SNL!!

[Henway]

For all the positives and negatives, I think there will be a whole lot of sales of googley eyes for people to put on their plants...

I saw in previous posts the writer for the Continental was out of town, but my goodness, you'd think they'd have 4 or 5 Continental skits in the Can waiting to be performed. They're not that difficult, but Walken animates it.

Still, disappointed at no The Continental...

[melbrit_snl]

I know its two weeks late, but i LOVED this show. It is my favourite one since the writers strike. I loved the googly eye plant guy, 'As Winston Churchill once said, the eyes are the windows to your face' funniest line ever! The Surprise Party was hilarious, Kristin Wiig always makes a skit really funny. The Larry King one was also one of my favorites, when he asks Jimmy Carter, 'Do you think anyone will read this book? Well I hope they do.' Haha. Very Funny. Christopher Walken is the best host, so far I think.

[bahramu]

This is normally Farelyrules job but i dont know where he is, anyway, its Christopher Walken/Panic at the Disco again tonight. Feel free to post your thoughts new/old and sbsr.

and to you Andy Samberg and your silly laser cats 3d*, i dont know how said it but “The reason lightning doesn't strike twice in the same place is that the same place isn't there the second time.”

winner, Me!!!

[Dr_Scientist]

Funny ****. That's all.

[farleyrules]

Upon second viewing, a couple of lines from Walken's monologue struck me as particularly funny. While chastising an audience member for failing to read the back of the card, Walken says: "You wouldn't think that reading off a card is so tricky. You look at the words, you read them. That's how it's done."

Whoever wrote Walken's monologue obviously noticed Walken's own card dependency and threw in a joke which foreshadows and mocks his own upcoming performance on the show (Nick will give us the technical term for this technique). Nice job.

This is normally Farelyrules job but i dont know where he is

I'm actually glad somebody else is on the job. It's nice to know I'm not the only one here with my finger in the dike. Nothing offensive intended BTW.

[ComedyWriter]

Whoever wrote Walken's monologue obviously noticed Walken's own card dependency and threw in a joke which foreshadows and mocks his own upcoming performance on the show (Nick will give us the technical term for this technique)

As far as I know, there is no name for that specific type of joke, but if pressed for an answer, I'd call it "predictive meta-comedy."

That one work for you?

-Nick

[farleyrules]

As far as I know, there is no name for that specific type of joke, but if pressed for an answer, I'd call it "predictive meta-comedy."

That one work for you?

-Nick

Yeah, that or "prescient self-mockery"

[bahramu]

why does it have to be predictive? can we bust out the thesaurus: Prognosticate, Presage are my two choices...

[ComedyWriter]

why does it have to be predictive? can we bust out the thesaurus: Prognosticate, Presage are my two choices...

I'm fine with "prognosticate," but take issue with "presage" as it classically involves the foretelling of bad things, and I don't consider Walken's card reading to be a bad thing.

While we are be thesaurical, why not "Preemptive A Posteriori Meta-Comedy?" Actually, there is a very good reason "why not" that any super nerd would call me out on...anyone want to reveal their nerdiness by telling me why we shouldn't call it that?

-Nick

[farleyrules]

I'm fine with "prognosticate," but take issue with "presage" as it classically involves the foretelling of bad things, and I don't consider Walken's card reading to be a bad thing.

While we are be thesaurical, why not "Preemptive A Posteriori Meta-Comedy?" Actually, there is a very good reason "why not" that any super nerd would call me out on...anyone want to reveal their nerdiness by telling me why we shouldn't call it that?

-Nick

I still think "prescient" is best because it anticipates the future events without casting judgment upon them.

I think the problem with "Preemptive A Posteriori Meta-Comedy" is that "A Posteriori" are conclusions based on events that have ALREADY happened. How can you pre-empt something you cannot forsee? Unless you are like Walken's character in the Dead Zone.

[ComedyWriter]

I think the problem with "Preemptive A Posteriori Meta-Comedy" is that "A Posteriori" are conclusions based on events that have ALREADY happened. How can you pre-empt something you cannot forsee? Unless you are like Walken's character in the Dead Zone.

While technically that is true, I was using it to imply that the premise of the joke was based on empirical, observable traits of Mr. Walken, using "preemptive" as a means to indicate that the a posteriori conclusion comes before the evidence of it. I will give you half credit, but there is an even nerdier reason for not liking the phrasing.

Here's a hint: it involves etymology.

I will agree, though, that prescient is easily one of the more apt choices for this scenario.

-Nick


PS: Man, it has been hard not to pick up my dictionary during the discourse just to double check what I believe these words to mean.

[bahramu]

(hikes up his nerd pants) now your getting into my wheel house....

A Posteriori is a philosophical term for inductive reasoning... or was that a priori, either way one of them is deductive reasoning and the other is inductive reasoning. they are the study of knowledge, but where a priori is independent of experience, a posteriori is dependent on experience. examples a priori "If Walken was on SNL, then he was probably in a skit" A prosteriori "Walken's snl show went from 11:30pm-1AM"....

(puts on the pocket protector) ok... so if "a prosterior" is based off experience then it couldn't be preemptive because that assumes it is something possible or anticipated and not based on experience.

now my question to this is "he has been on the show before, so the first time it couldnt have been preemptive but now that they know he (and others) rely on cards from past experience, couldnt this one be preemptive a prosteriori?"

(and it looks like i was late on the nerd post)

[bahramu]

ok... sorry for the double post but i cant edit my original anymore... i will admit i had to look this up because i hate waiting for answers...

A posteriori means "from what comes later" or "After experience" so if you used this as a substitute your sentence (preemptive a posteriori) would be "taken as a measurement against something possible after experience"

[joannzinaman]

why does it have to be predictive? can we bust out the thesaurus: Prognosticate, Presage are my two choices...

Hey Bahramu. Giving Credence to the Greased Lightning Skit, How about Fleem Maker Upper ? Jody

[farleyrules]

now my question to this is "he has been on the show before, so the first time it couldnt have been preemptive but now that they know he (and others) rely on cards from past experience, couldnt this one be preemptive a prosteriori?"

Very good point! The fact that Walken has been on the show before provides a set of data from which to draw conclusions about future behavior. So, yes it could still be A Posteriori because there is a vast amount of observable events indicating that he will rely on the cards. Of course, past performance does not always predict future events, but Walken is not likely to break his routine.

[st8angel]

Yes. Remember, they have to write, cast, and direct all of the sketches in just 5 days, then they have to build all of the sets and create all of the costumes. Then, even when they do rehearse, there is little guarantee that the piece won't change drastically between then and when it goes to air.

I just get the feeling that a lot of you haven't been watching the show closely enough. Blatantly looking at the cue cards is nothing new and has been joked about for years on SNL. With the schedule that they work within, there is just no way around it...unless they start using ear pieces like they used for Stevie Wonder.

In regards to Walken, he has always read off the cue cards. Go back and watch the Blue Oyster Cult/"More Cowbell" sketch and watch as Walken reads every line off the cards as if it was the first time he had ever seen the words. That's one of the reason I love watching Walken host; he looks like he's completely out of his depth and, for all we know, he is, but he plays it up in classic Christopher Walken style which makes it all the funnier in the end. Maybe I'm alone in that sentiment, who knows.

-Nick

Do you really think that excuse can be used in a skit like the Grease skit in which he says the same lines repetitively? I can't imagine that anyone could not remember the line... "That's dirty. Do you know what that means?" He said it 3-4 times and looked at the cue cards every time! I am not an actor in any sense of the word, but I feel I could have pulled that off by the third time. I turned it off... Painful to watch! (Which is a shame because lately there has been so much good writing and talent!)

[Dr_Scientist]

^I loved that sketch...

On the Best Of Mike Myers, one dress skit gets cut because Walken is reading the damn cue cards. It was a really funny skit too, poor Mike.

[ComedyWriter]

He said it 3-4 times and looked at the cue cards every time!

There is one rule with cue cards. If you use them, keep using them. If you don't, don't. To have an actor switch between two focal points makes it even more obvious that he's reading, and even more obvious when he's not really looking at the rest of the cast. If he did go off the cards for parts he would have resembled a typewriter with his head moving back and forth at the end of lines and such.

Also keep in mind that the cue cards may only have 1-5 lines on them, with changes on them that the host has never seen. So, while he may have said "That's dirty" more than once he won't know whether the other instances of it remain until they reach that particular card.

As I posted in the Steve Carrel episode thread, I went to the show last week, and I saw the cue cards, they are marked up to high hell, so I can understand why someone, like Walken, might feel the need to have a staring contest with them right then and there.

-Nick