I mean...seriously. I love this season, so far. It's all gold...except for this. I was REALLY hoping they'd kill Claire's girlfriend with that hook...

They are just friends no one ever said they were dating.

Yes, they didn't say it, but by not saying it they are evoiding it; which is weak, cause now they are doing it cause they either don't know (Claire might suddenly be into girls: no big deal, but kinda out of sink with her past), or cause they hope for a raitings spike---either way, not so good.

You are just jumping to conclusions the kiss was only for ratings which didn't do much.

They IMPLIED it... I do think it's ratings, honestly, as that character is only listed as a guest star, but it's still painful to watch... Claire yelling "I need you!" really made me cringe. Please end this fast, NBC...

Is it written in the rules that Claire can't be a bi/lesbian? Heroes standard? What the heck are you talking about?

They're doing what all the little dramas do for ratings, and it really doesn't fit for Claire, anyway. Just awkward. Some people may disagree, but that's okay...we all have opinions.

What do you mean it doesn't really fit for Claire? Has Claire shown displeasure or hate for gay people? If I remember correctly, her best friend in High School was gay. Just because she has a power, doesn't mean she can't ever become curious. They've never shown or implied anything that would make us believe that Claire's character is somehow immune to becoming a bi-sexual/lesbian.

In 5YG she was definately engaged to a GUY. Her lifeline has already been shown to be very hetero sexual.


Also, just because Zach was hinted at by writers to be originally gay, it was never dealt with because the actor refused - that means it was never on the show, and as far as show canon goes, Zach could be the nerdy straight kid with a crush, for all we know. Girls picking on him would be just as realistic.

What does Five Years Gone have to do with anything?

And all we saw in that future was that she was with a guy. Even though 5YG is completely irrelevant in this discussion, she could very well have been with a girl at some point in that future. She could be with Gretchen and still end up with a guy in this timeline. But we're talking about two completely different timelines here.

People are forgetting that college is often the time when people experiment.

And Claire hasn't officially decided she wants to be with Gretchen. She is confused, which is perfectly normal.

The only two reasons I could think of why you dislike this whole thing:

1) You think that Gretchen is ugly, and hence you wanting her killed off the show. How judgmental are you, really? In my opinion, she's just fine.
2) You dislike lesbians.



No, they didn't imply it. It was all you. There's nothing in the scenes that supports this assumption.
And if it's so painful for you to watch them, don't watch them and skip to the next scenes! Very simple to do!



Ratings? Since when Claire became the main thing for ratings?
If Heroes was mainly all about leeching ratings, the whole plot would be x10000 worse!
It doesn't fit for Claire? That's your opinion! Awkward how? That she's kissing girls? Jeeez!



Now, now, why are you contradicting? At first, you assumed that she has a girlfriend. And now, you've just assumed that she's confused and that she doesn't know if she wants to be with Gretchen. How wonderful!

Two different people. I nearly made the same mistake and thought maybe he had a split personality.

Agree with the rest though.

I sure hope Claire has a girlfriend, they are adorable together.

I have real issues with this statement. I, myself, cannot stand Gretchen. I don't think she's ugly, and I really dont think that her sexual orientation is a deciding factor in the issue. She's just really stalkery, and she really doesnt interest me. She's not a enthralling character to me. She just flops. Alrighty then?

Exactly!

Obviously the kiss was exploited as a ratings stunt, but the story itself fits completely with the character. This is a girl that really has no idea who she is anymore. Half way through High School her world turned upside down and she's trying to figure things out. Confusion is completely normal.

Claire likes her as a friend, what bothers me is that Gretchen has had several boy friends and then she decides she's gay, okay. Wouldn't bisexual be more appropriate.

She never decided she was gay, bisexual is exactly how she described herself, if not with that particular word. She's had more bfs than gfs, and right now she just likes Claire.

Agreed.

A myth. Which I already pointed out in another thread elsewhere. Guys might want to think that, but it's not true. But I'm not going through that whole argument again because if some people would like to believe that and fly in the face of logic, reality and statistics I can't change their minds.

I will say the most offensive part is just what Vagrant said. It's strictly a ratings stunt...a poorly written one at that. Cheap and silly.

Would you elighten us by providing the statistics you're referencing? Thanks!

Statistics aside, Claire simply doesn't know who she is at this point in life. If some girl comes on to her it makes sense that she may be confused by it. They aren't forcing an agenda, I think its being portrayed realistically.

Couldn't agree more. It's just plain boring as well.

I agree. I want this to end FAST. I'm not against bis, i just really don't like seeing clair like that, especially with Gretchen! I'm sorry but Gretchen just really annoys me.

What myth is that? I am sure that not everybody experiments in college and I am sure that most people study more than party. But, it still happens. For people who are away from home for the first time in their life, they may do things they didn't think they would do before.

Claire latches on to any friend she can make because she had so few friends the last few years of her life. Gretchen represents something that Claire really wants: a friend and a normal life. I think Claire's story is written well and the story is unfolding at a good pace.

As I said in the other topic where the argument took place, I'm not flying the face of reality.

The truth is, some of us actually know women who experimented in college. Some of us know women who learned they were lesbians in college. Some of us know women who learned they weren't lesbians in college.

That's the reason I and others find the Claire/Gretchen story believable- because we know people it happened to.

No. A ratings stunt would be Claire and Gretchen going at it like they were both dogs in heat. This is actually a story.

Hate to say it but I do think the scenes were a bit... awkward as well lol.

I kinda thought it was out of character a bit, like some others. Not neccessarily because it is not a "believable storyline", but because of the way it was presented. Such as Claire looking like she was about to "give in" and kiss Gretchen when the car drove over a bump.

I was a bit disappointed in the presentation of the storyline this episode actually, because I think this is the first time all season that I felt that any of the characters acted out of character.

Again, it's not because the storyline elements are not believable - just that it was not presented in a believable way - kinda rushed.

I'm not interested in Claires love life. male or female.

I'm cool with people being homosexual.. but try watching this horrible waste of air time with a Christian family member. It's so awkward. "...are they gay or something?" ..."What is this show about?"

This was all for the ratings. If it wasn't, they would have had Peter turn gay or something. That wouldn't have turned out so well! Peter is busy trying to save lives.. meets up with HRG who is depressed and alone in his apartment. Peter comforts HRG with a back massage. "Hey, it'll be okay. I'll save you." Peter leans in to kiss HRG.. and then all the male viewers turn the show off or fast forward past the scene.

Yes---"Kinda Rushed"---Exactly.

lol, I'm just surprised I didn't see any posts about this. When Gretchen was asking Claire about them, Claire just said she didn't know. Even though she probably had more important things on her mind, I would think that a heterosexual person would blatantly say "sorry, I don't swing that way." Not "I just don't want to ruin our friendship..." That is something a friend says to another friend after one friend wants more after a long term friendship.

So what do u think? Are they gonna make a lesbian relationship out of this? I think Possibly.

I sure hope not! I hope they kill her off before the whole entire season is riddled with this nauseating nothingness of a story!

it might just be me, but every time Claire's arc is on, i dont care to watch. i can see where it is going, but i just wish it would get there already - this whole sorority/college thing is really dulling things up in my opinion. i dont care if Claire has bisexual feelings, i dont care that she just wants a "normal life" - she needs to just give up that quest.

Check the "CED" section.

I think its either a plot to increase ratings and to get more young male and homosexual viewers, or to keep the Claire character interesting because they have nothing important for her to do this season. But what about this...what if the Gretchen character is just playing dumb...?? Maybe she has some kind of power also and she is aware of whats going on with the Carnies being interested in Claire. Maybe shes after the Carnies and is just trying to stay close to Claire to protect her or to get to them. Maybe she pulled the whole "I'm crushing on you" thing to keep Claire from being suspicious. I mean it is kinda weird that she had a whole profile of Claire right on her computer and chose to leave the room without turning it off or clearing the screen. Why would Gretchen need a profile of Claire already loaded on her screen when they were hanging out everyday at that point? And that whole convo about "opposite attractors" seemed to be alluding to something more than just relationship-wise...what do you think???

this surprised me my girls are no longer allowed to watch Heroes with me live... my wife and I watch it first then if we allow it, they can watch it the next day with me fast forwarding parts we deem inappropriate

Its a cheap, badly written, offensive ratings stunt.

Haha I like all of your reactions. And I agree with you. They definitely did this for more viewers and ratings, and I sure hope your right, Pyramyd, that would make Gretchen's story a whole lot more interesting. Quite frankly, I'm also tired of Claire's "I wanna fit in" act as well.

As I stated in another thread devoted to the same topic, if this was a ratings stunt it would have been handled differently.

Instead of a microsecond kiss that left Claire not feeling much of anything but confused, it would have been a full blown, barely safe for PG TV, sex scene.

It might not have been a poor attempt for ratings. Then WHAT was it! It did not, nor does not fit the storyline. I think the writers have lost the way

1: Hayden, not the writers, came up with the subplot.
2: In case you haven't been watching the show at all...including having missed the entire first season...there is always subplot that has nothing to do with the main plot. Kind of like real life. There's always something going on that has nothing to do with the primary focus.

This whole Gretchen and Claire kiss thing just irritates me. What was NBC thinking! I am very disappointed. This used to be one of my favorite shows. One that I could watch with my kids. It's in a prime time 8:00 slot where all the kid's can watch it. My kid's don't need to see this garbage. They've had some questionable stuff before (drug use, suggestive scenes) I've used that to start duscussions with the kids, but I'm tired of it. They've gone to far this time. My kid's and I are no longer watching this show. NBC you screwed up and I hope your ratings tank!

Attacking Other Members- Good way to lose your posting privileges.

I don't think it fits her as a character---I mean, there's no grounded background for it, but don't care one way or the other if its well written.

If I wanted to see gay I'd watch Will and Grace or something else. Heroes wasn't presented originally as a program with gay content. It was aimed at the general population. This ploy reminds me of BONES (FOX) and what they did with the Angela Montenegro character. It didn't work then and it won't work now. It's not that gay bothers me it's when a TV show presents a person as strait for 3 seasons and then suddenly they are gay. It reeks of politics to me. Trying to push gay on the general public. In the case of Angela (BONES) she was married after a drunken fling with a buffed out guy at a beach resort. Then she gets starried eyed at every guy that came in the lab ready to jump his bones (no pun intended). By season 3 she is in love with one of the main characters that she was spending all of season 2 jousting with. Then in season 4 she suddenly splits with her love to shack up with an old 10 years ago college roommate she had a gay fling with. Now Claire, presented as a typical boy crazy teen for the last 3 seasons suddenly is questioning her sexuality. Its different if the character is presented initially as gay and you can identify or not with that character, i.e. Will and Grace. Hollywood thinks every person outside of their circle thinks like they do. If it's politics it sucks; no different than watching a show like Sons of Anarchy (FX) and the whole biker gang all of a sudden gets religion! Keep the politics off shows. If its a sleazy sexual encounter then it also sucks and in my book isn't working, if that's what you want watch Nip and Tuck. I watch Heroes for it's fun, uniqueness and excitement not the writer's or broadcasting company's political statements or for sexual content. The writers need to get back on the script!!!!

Do Not Cross-Post.

I agree with daja_vu...it seems to be a political thing. I have taken notice that as of late every comedy in the movies has some sort of homosexual content...it is almost as if this lifestyle is being forcibly pushed onto the American public to make it acceptable. I am a young male so I was turned on by the kiss. However, it should have ended there. The whole "I need you outburst" turned my stomach. If a relationship comes out of all this then I will probably drift slowly from Heroes...I don't care about whether or not someone is gay or not because it is none of my business, however that type of relationship should have been presented in season 1 instead of being forced on the fans after we've come this far...besides, Claire should be a role model for young girls to be confident, independant and to not be promiscuous or do drugs (like Britney Spears was). Homosexuality has no place with this character.

I completely agree with daja_vu! I don't have a problem with the gay kid on Fox's new show "Glee" because you knew what you were getting from the beginning. I also don't have a problem with the gay couple on ABC's new show "Modern Family". Once again, you know what you are getting from the beginning. They aren't playing the bait and switch game on you. You also don't see any of these characters making out with the other boys on the show. My kid's don't need to see that. Like I said before, this show's on at 8:00! If they want to get into all that then move the show to 10:00 after the kids go to bed and I won't care as much!!! I'm still very disappointed in NBC and what they did to this show. They have lost my family as viewers because I am not letting my kids watch this show anymore.

How should Claire have handled this situations? Claire should have punched Gretchen in the mouth when Gretchen planted that kiss on her. That should have come first. After she didn't do that, she should have told Gretchen she didn't swing that way instead of saying she wasn't sure how she felt. Instead the show tried to be trendy and politically correct. What a disappointment.

For everyone crying out this story is just a ratings stunt.

Isn;t that what any storyline in a tv show about?

If you dont like something dont watch it.

For me i like this storyline i think its been presented right and its not over the top or x-rated

It is showing exactly what claire is and thats confused ever since the show started claire has struggled to find her place in the world constantly trying to be something, so those that think claire being confused about something doesn;t fit her character just which show have you been watching?

I didn't like gretchen at first but i kind of like her now.

Didn't really like the invisible girl at all and didn;t understand the point in what she was doing, if she wanted to kill gretchen then why not do it like the old room mate of claires, why the other 2 girls and why around claire? its proberly just that i dont understand though

So wait drugs murder and suggestive scenes are ok for your kids to watch but 2 girls kissing is to much?

Thinking someone is homophobic

Why should a gay kiss not be seen at prime time hours, there is no difference between same sex kissing and none same sex kissing.

It wasn't even that much of a kiss lol, bet you didn't complain when nikki was straddling nathan in season 1 or other romances and suggestive scenes but make it a gay kiss and you cant handle it so funny and pretty pathetic homophobic people like you are still around

Wheres you complaint about parkmen and his wife having sex? that is more explicit then a few second peck on the lips between 2 girls oh wait i forgot its because you are homophobic